peer exchange/peer caching.

[wiggo]

Did you see my screenshot? I'm downloading from *this* tracker, even though I am not connected to their tracker. I am not allowed to download more than one at a time, but here I am downloading this other one without being connected to their tracker. And the private flag is set properly, and DHT is disabled.

Now, I admit, I don't know if this is really uTorrent doing anything wrong. But something is wrong... right? I mean, this isn't normal behavior, unless DHT is enabled, right?

-Ares

You should start another thread about that. We are discussing another matter in this thread.

[Ultima]

?? That's not another matter... It's more-or-less the same problem. Ares uses the tracker in question, and is providing proof that µTorrent *does* indeed connect to peers even though he can't connect to the tracker on that torrent.

[wiggo]

@wiggo: I never said that µTorrent was at fault. I said that what the other people from the tracker described seemed to point directly at µTorrent. I said (specifically) that more solid proof is needed. Why should I have to explain myself (or what you're asking)?

You said that it's a bad approach to blame everything but uTorrent, and I gave you an explanation that you are wrong about that. And since you think that this could be a problem with uTorrent, I gave an explanation that should change your mind. So you and the rest of us can try to find the REAL problem.

And what I was asking was, if you still think that a bug in uTorrent is the fault, please explain to me technically how that could be possible. Because it isn't. A bicycle that doesn't carry petrol can't leak petrol.

[wiggo]

?? That's not another matter... It's more-or-less the same problem. Ares uses the tracker in question, and is providing proof that µTorrent *does* indeed connect to peers even though he can't connect to the tracker on that torrent.

It's not another matter?

I thought this thread was about uTorrent leaking the private peerlist to "illegal" peers, and NOT about uTorrent being able to download two files at the same time from a private (download limited) tracker. You tell me I'm wrong?

[Firon]

You can do that on any tracker, I have before. It's very easy. Start one, get a peerlist, stop it, start another, get a peerlist. Start the other one. Tada, you just bypassed the limit. You can do it on just about any client except Mainline.

However, wiggo is right, this has absolutely nothing to do with the thread.

[DreadWingKnight]

Up until now' date=' While reading this thread, I am yet to see any evidence that uTorrent is doing anything wrong. Im also waiting on thebrass' reply on DreadWingKnight's suggestions regarding the metadata's validity.[/quote']

Did you see my screenshot? I'm downloading from *this* tracker, even though I am not connected to their tracker. I am not allowed to download more than one at a time, but here I am downloading this other one without being connected to their tracker. And the private flag is set properly, and DHT is disabled.

Now, I admit, I don't know if this is really uTorrent doing anything wrong. But something is wrong... right? I mean, this isn't normal behavior, unless DHT is enabled, right?

-Ares

I went through some processes on the tracker.

What happens is that, under certain conditions, the tracker will still have information on a previous instance of your client on the tracker, so the tracker will send peers your way.

Note in the screenshot the "DHT: Not Allowed"

This means that something else MUST be giving µTorrent the peers, either another peer actually on the torrent, or some botch in the tracker.

This sort of connection situation happened with me using ABC instead of µTorrent. ABC doesn't have peer exchange OR DHT. How did it get the peers?

µTorrent is honoring the private flag. It doesn't have peer exchange. The peer connections it's getting are coming from elsewhere.

µTorrent, like mainline (which won't DHT while a tracker url is present and doesn't have any other peer exchange mechanism), bittornado and abc (both of which don't have DHT or peer exchange at all), will accept incoming connections from other clients regardless of how those clients found out about them. Trigger the same conditions as you used to get on to that second torrent and you'll get the same behavior.

I still don't see proof that µTorrent is actually allowing external peers into a swarm any more than other clients do.

[wiggo]

µTorrent, like mainline (which won't DHT while a tracker url is present and doesn't have any other peer exchange mechanism), bittornado and abc (both of which don't have DHT or peer exchange at all), will accept incoming connections from other clients regardless of how those clients found out about them. Trigger the same conditions as you used to get on to that second torrent and you'll get the same behavior.

I still don't see proof that µTorrent is actually allowing external peers into a swarm any more than other clients do.

That's normal behavior for all clients. And that's NOT what we are discussing in this thread.

We are discussing if uTorrent is giving the private tracker peerlist to "external"/"illegal" peers. I guess it's hard to continue that discussion here since many people don't read/understand what the thread is about before posting messages.

So back to the topic, how can we solve this issue and what have been done so far?

The tracker admins were worried that uTorrent share the peerlist to "illegal" peers. So they banned uTorrent from the tracker. Now the matter has been discussed and it's clear that uTorrent NEVER share the peerlist to anyone since there's no such feature/function/protocol in uTorrent.

My suggestion is that the tracker admins perform more tests and try to locate the real source of the problem. Now when they know that the problem is not in uTorrent, they can continue their research and try to find other reasons why their private peerlists are being leaked. And I will be happy to hear back from them with the results.

[Ares]

*waves white flag*

[ZzDr.Fred]

I swear.. this whole forum is full of people who talk in circles and accomplish nothing..... I assume that most of you are 12?

I started this thread and asked something and maybe some help... but as I follow the thread... I find myself with nothing more than when I started.

oh well... I guess that no one moderates or controls the forum... they mostly let the forum flies rule the thread.

[Ultima]

Erm, you're saying that you didn't find out that µTorrent doesn't have Peer Exchange? That's past where you started, no? In fact, you were only asking to turn off Peer Exchange in the beginning. Seeing as how you now *should* know that there is no Peer Exchange, you are in a totally different place than you started.

You're not getting answers because no one knows what the problem is. Unless you can figure it out from the information given so far... in which case, please enlighten us.

[1c3d0g]

I tried to be as helpful as possible (refer to my previous post in this thread), unfortunately it seems someone is pissed off because their tracker doesn't play nice with µTorrent and decided to burn bridges with this client and its developers...

[wiggo]

Ares:

You got the peer list from the tracker. Read what Firon wrote. And it doesn't matter if you TRY to do it manually. It will still automatically happen because of different reconnect-timeouts. Your messages are totally offtopic and has nothing to do with this thread. So please stop posting.

I think this topic should be locked since it's going nowhere further. The question that has been asked has been answered and there's nothing more to discuss. There's nothing more the uTorrent team can do to solve this problem since the problem is not in uTorrent. However, if the tracker admin need any more information about how uTorrent work I'm sure that the uTorrent team will assist with proper information so the problem can be solved as fast as possible.

[thebrass]

http://forum.utorrent.com/viewtopic.php?id=1570

ROFLMAO- and thats just one

ya yup nothing wrong with this client !- Just look @ all of the posts in thease forums the client is riddled with bugs-

and as far as me talking to anyone here bout anything is very unlikely-just look @ your posts -what a bunch of babies-then you spam my site with your shit

first you dis the shit out of me then you come to me for help -da what do you think im going to say

and ya its the coding of the tracker thats why so many other trackers are having the same problem with this client -

added below

They IP banned me from their site, I get a cute little redirect to google. Why I don't know, I didn't do anything to them. I'd use a proxy to post again but I just don't care enough to. I guess they're so insecure about themselves that they had to ban someone relaying messages between forums to feel better.

Yes you were banned for spamming my site-

[Firon]

Spamming? That's bull and you know it.

Also, those other trackers aren't having a problem anymore.

Half the bug reports aren't bugs, more people who don't do things right. Many are really requests for a feature to work a different way. Have you seen the amount of fixes Azureus makes every day? Might wanna check the sourceforce mailing list for it.

No one came to you for help, we wanted to resolve the situation and find what the actual cause of the problem was, not the totally unfounded crap you gave. Just leave already, I don't see why you even bothered to make another post, you obviously have no interest in working with anyone here to find out what's causing your problem.

[infirmus]

http://forum.utorrent.com/viewtopic.php?id=1570

ROFLMAO- and thats just one

Yeah and did you even bother reading how old that thread is? That problem was fixed ages ago. Stop carrying on like a child.

[laffin]

It's also funny that utorrent does not follow the announce private flag. which shud stop dht on that torrent' date=' if a tracker reports it as a private.

My thoughts, DHT in utorrent is still incomplete. so is a risk factor on these private torrents sites.[/quote']

In this you are mistaken. Open a .torrent with the PRIVATE flag enabled. Double click the torrent in the list to see the Properties window. The checkbox labeled "Enable DHT" will be grayed out. If this is not the case, then the .torrent does not have the PRIVATE flag.

Merged post(s):

Someone REALLY needs to do a good write up for DHT in the Documentation forum because so many people seem to be completely misinformed.

EDIT by silverfire: Please do not double post!

What part of Announce private flag is incomprehensible to you.

Under BitComet protocol, the announce url can send a private flag setting. which disables dht for that torrent, even if others have it enabled.

This has nothing to do with the torrent creation process.

[Firon]

Only BitComet supports that, nor is it an official extension/change to the tracker protocol.

The actual standard is to use private with the value 1 in the infodict.

[bkman]

What part of Announce private flag is incomprehensible to you.

Under BitComet protocol, the announce url can send a private flag setting. which disables dht for that torrent, even if others have it enabled.

This has nothing to do with the torrent creation process.

I have never heard of this "announce private flag". The "private flag" which has been well known and in use since the Azureus devs came up with it is included during torrent creation, and tells clients which support it to disable distributed tracking and peer-exchange for that torrent.

[bkman]

Thanks for the info, Firon, but to be fair Azureus' private flag is not a standard either. That is it was never accepted by Bram into the official spec to my knowledge, even if all DHT enabled clients follow it.

I think that it is pretty silly of a tracker to only use this announce private mode if only BC supports it, however.

[Firon]

Really? Hm, I thought it'd actually become something standard, not just something everyone used.

Still, it's pretty pointless imo, you'd be better off using the private flag in the torrent since all the DHT enabled clients support it right now, and it's guaranteed to work.

Think if you got the torrent and the tracker wasn't accessible from the start, DHT would never get disabled, right? Or if you got banned from the tracker, or weren't registered, you wouldn't get the response either. And if it did anyway (highly unlikely), someone could easily just remove the tracker URL, and voilá.

[laffin]

Not really, since torrents come into the hands of users. Users with editors, can make the torrent a DHT enabled torrent.

The BitComet Announce Private flag defeats this. So the tracker decides if it's private or open, not the user who creates a torrent.

check this url: http://wiki.bitcomet.com/help/Tracker_HTTP_Protocol uner the tracker->client section.

I did notice a problem using this method, it works great in BitComet, but other clients may report an error in the tracker response.

I think this job falls under the tracker admins and coders.

But Utorrent coders to add this feature to their client.

[thebrass]

Spamming? That's bull and you know it.

Well thats what I and the rest of the world call it-don't know what you do ........

Also, those other trackers aren't having a problem anymore.

yes a lot of trackers are having problems -althought it might might be unbeknownst to you and your and this forums feeble mind set-when it comes down to it this so called forum is nothing more then a mud slinging contest-that I will neglect to partake in-but one word of advice to you grow up-

No one came to you for help, we wanted to resolve the situation and find what the actual cause of the problem was, not the totally unfounded crap you gave. Just leave already, I don't see why you even bothered to make another post, you obviously have no interest in working with anyone here to find out what's causing your problem.

See there is your brains showing again and the mind set of both this forum and project !

I gave you no data and never even discussed it with you -and your right I don't have any intention of talking to you and anyone here about it.......and why is that you might ask, just look @ these 3 pages of absolute trash-started by and ex member of the site that as usual goes off half-cocked starting bulshit -as I was in the testing phase when he had to come here and start shit -and thats why he is banned- and you think that I want to talk to you about anything after these posts -you must be daft

regards

EDIT added below

and the sad part is i would of been happy to get togher with the staff on this proj.....before all of the insults started

[celtic_raven]

any change of getting this problem solved or is every one just gona bitch around and blame the other side.

so far all ive seen is someone blaming the upload-code in the tracker, and 31% of the voters on the mentioned tracker saying ghost-connections have cut down since μtorrent is banned.

nice to know all that, but is there any point in waiting for a fix or should we just give up and use other clients for simular trackers?????????????????

[chaosblade]

thebrass; perheps if you showed some will to help rather then go on insisting uTorrent is bugged and has a poor implementation of the protocol (including a very, VERY old thread about a bug long fixed) then someone would have the motivation to help figure out whats wrong.

I'm still not sure how did banning uTorrent help - It has DHT disabled on those trackers, has no other means of sending peer IPs to anywhere else.

[wiggo]

yes a lot of trackers are having problems -althought it might might be unbeknownst to you and your and this forums feeble mind set-when it comes down to it this so called forum is nothing more then a mud slinging contest-that I will neglect to partake in-but one word of advice to you grow up

You tell us you don't want to participate in a mud slinging contest, and then you tell us to grow up. By saying that I think you are already participating in the mud slinging contest. Congratulations.

First of all, you should know that this forum is like the rest of the world, where everyone has the free right to speak. And when people has the free right to speak, then there will always be name calling. Public forums aren't some kind of magic heaven exception. If you don't want to continue trying to solve the problem just because 0.0001% of the uTorrent users said something like "The tracker admin is stupid/He has no brain", then it's up to you.

Honestly, I don't think it's strange if people say that the tracker admin is stupid when someone say that the tracker admin has banned uTorrent because of a feature that isn't implemented. I think this pretty normal behavior. We did not even start the name calling. I don't understand why you take the name calling personally. The name calling wasn't even directed to a specific person. Some people here just meant that a tracker admin out there is stupid because he has banned uTorrent because of a feature that isn't implemented.

The REAL name calling actually start when ltzergling1 (One of your tracker staff?) say

Sure... utorrent doesnt have peer exchange. So why does it do this. Probaly poor coding. What do you expect from a client 90KB in size, theres bound to be problems with it.

Before ltzergling1 posted that people have just been saying "There's a tracker admin out there that is stupid", people here never directed the name calling to a specific product/person, but ltzergling1 is the first person who actually start the name calling by stating that a specific product/person is bad since he mention the name uTorrent.

And WHY in the name of god would we listen to someone that say that the fault is in uTorrent because it's only 90KB in size!?!?

Can someone please explain that to me. You want us to take you seriously? Then please give us real facts to the discussion.

I think the utorrent forums users has been VERY patient in this matter. And several attempts has been made to stop the name calling and trying to move on and find the real problem. But you don't coorporate at all in trying to move on and stop the name calling, and you end the discussion saying that it's WE that need to grow up.

Come on man. This is just pathethic. Why does the utorrent users even BOTHER to try and help those tracker admins?